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Location

Message

Date Posted

Northeast

Will Subdue and Clearys kill M Roots and root shield ?

4/11/2004 6:46:19 PM

[email protected]

Dave,

I found the database I was telling you about.

The leading authority on these matters is "Koppert's Side Effects Database". Check it out. Everyone should bookmark this website if they intend to use beneficials or innoculants.


http://www.koppert.nl/e0110.html


Trichoderma harzianum (Rootshield)
Treated with:
Metalaxyl (Subdue)
Rated 1 for less than 25% mortality (safest rating)


Trichoderma harzianum (Rootshield)
Treated with:
thiophanate-methyl
Rated 1 for less than 25% mortality (safest rating)

Koppert's doesn't rank Mycorrhizhae. It's a funny search engine. But it is considered the leading authority for the greenhouse growers. They use beneficials & biologicals more than field growers.

Steve

4/11/2004 10:11:53 PM

Puyallup, WA

One out of four chances that your plant will die?? Not too
reassuring it would seem.

4/11/2004 11:20:50 PM

[email protected]

Nooooooo....less than 25% of the beneficial Trichoderma are killed by the Subdue application. So 75+% live to innoculate the host root system in actual greenhouse trials. This is good, since the Bioshield (Trichoderma sp T22) exclude rhizoctonia (a soil pathogen) fungi.

Thr trouble with certain fungicides is that they can cause harm to beneficials. If a pest problem is really bad & big guns must be used, then we need to insure that the big guns aren't also killing beneficials. If they are, then buying & introducing beneficials (Rootshield) would be a waste of money.

In this case, Dave's Rootshield won't be killed by either the Subdue or the Cleary's 3336G that he intends to use. By itself, Rootshield doesn't offer very impressive disease control. About 30% control, which pales compared to the chemicals. But so long as the chemicals don't destroy the Rootshield, it is nice insurance that offers other growing benefits to the host (pumpkin).

My bad. Dave & I were talking about this earlier in the day. So he knew what I was posting about. Anyone else coming in on the conversation might assume the worst as well. Sorry about that!

Steve

4/12/2004 7:04:08 AM

Western Pa.

The Clearys 3336 and Topsum M ARE extremely toxic to earthworms!

4/12/2004 10:05:08 AM

Montoursville, PA

Absolutely anyone can make good product bad product discovery without dependance on any one person or manufacturer's claim. Take a baking tin with one to two inch sides. In one side of the tin place a tablespoon full of the product in question. At the other side of the tin place half dozen earthworms. If the worms go to the product and eat it the product is safe to use....providing the worms live a week or so after ingesting the product. Keep your test worms in a small container to see if they live or die. If they won't eat it don't even think of using it in your patch.

Make sure you properly and completely wash the wife's baking tin. If the product ate a hole in the tin buy the wife another cake pan, quick. :)

4/13/2004 11:42:17 AM

[email protected]

Kopperts sells only organic & biological greenhouse controls. They are not endorsing the use of chemicals & indeed advocate them as a last resort only.

See their products at:

http://www.koppert.nl/e005.shtml

4/13/2004 6:24:28 PM