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Deer Park, WI

Im asking for your opinions to the following question- Do Ag's benefit from hardening off? The reason I ask is cuz for the 3 years i have been growing, everytime i move my seeds from indoors to outdoors it takes up to 3 weeks before they pick up and take off in true AG fashion. Maybe its the cold WI climate, maybe its some other factor. I dunno. So Im asking for your experiences...has anyone ever tried hardening off a seedling before transplanting? anyone else experience this "slow period"? Please share your experiences so we can all get a handle on this. Im gonna try hardening off a few plants this spring to see what happens. Thanks for your participation!

2/5/2004 9:26:54 AM

Montoursville, PA

A four inch pot will be pot bound in five or six days. Pot bound plants have to reorganize and send out new roots from the outside edge of the root ball.

I have experienced no delay or slow down when going into the cold frames roughly between the dates of May 6th. to the 10th. Our last frost date is May 25th - June 5th. My plants take right off and the vines are out four to five feet and running by June 5th.

I use half gallon ice cream tubs for the seven to ten days they are in a pot. When I remove the icecream container the roots are just begining to show at the bottom and the outside edges. They can just keep on going without breaking out of a bound up root mass, in a pot that was, to small.

2/5/2004 10:44:29 AM

Webster, NY

docgipe, when you remove the plants from the half gallon tubs, are there enough roots to hold the soil together, or is the soil falling out all over the place? How do you remove the tub, and get it in the ground in one piece. Thanks for the info...

Dave

2/5/2004 11:12:20 AM

Cameron,ontario Team Lunatic

I cut the bottom off the containers and turn them upside down and plant the seedlings in them. This way I can just take the lid off the bottom and slide the container up over the plant without too much damage to the roots. I have done this for a couple years now with alot of success. As far as hardening off, I start putting the seedling outside for a couple hours a day in a portable greenhouse to help the plant get used to the temperature change.

Phil

2/5/2004 11:29:40 AM

Cornwall UK.(50N 5W)300ft.

No check noticed here but I do use polythene to warm the soil for 2 or 3 weeks before planting out.I don't live on the top of a mountain though and have a fairly level climate.
A young seedling can have a 12" tap root by the time it breaks the surface.12 into 4 doesn't go imho.

2/5/2004 11:35:56 AM

I'm with Gordon... GO UTES!

Here's a tip when using ice cream tubs or something
similar... cut the tub lengthwise, and then reassemble
it with a piece of duct tape (as shown in the Holland
videos). This should make it fairly easy to remove the
seedling without breaking up the root ball.

Of course, you can also slide the root ball out the
bottom if the leaves are still small (which they ought
to be...).

Which reminds me, I need to start eating more ice cream...

As for AG's and hardening off... they really just don't
like cold! Anything below 50 degrees F, they just sit
there and do nothing. I would highly recommend a large
cloche (hoophouse). Last year I tried some plants inside
hoophouses, and some outside. The difference was like
night and day...

http://idahopumpkin.tripod.com

Regards, Cliff

2/5/2004 12:29:31 PM

Brillion Wisconsin

I'm starting to think that hardening off the seedlings does little for the plants. The slow couple of weeks following transplanting may be because at that stage of their life a big healthly root system is more important than vines & leaves. Most of the growth is going on under the soil.

This past year I got a late start and it was June 1st before I got some plants in and It still took a while for them to really start putting on the vine.

We start our seeds in soil that is between 80 and 90 degees. Once transplanted outside the drop in soil temp. might just be too much, especially at night, thus putting the brakes on any visible growth.

2/5/2004 1:22:06 PM

Western NY

well, i try to get them outside as soon as posible. and by that, i mean, as soon as i pull off the old seed shell, i get them outside to let the sun hit them, even if i keep them in the pot for a few days before i plant them. i think a lot of the lag time between planting and growth has to do with the adjustment from artificial light to natural light as much as anything. this is why it's better to plant them out on a stretch of cloudy days if they've been inside for a long time. temperature is another big factor, but that's what plastic is for.

2/5/2004 1:32:51 PM

Brillion Wisconsin

No wait...forget my last post. I know why they slow down after transplant. Its the lack of musicical vibrations out in the garden. From the early begining of my plants life, from the seed filing and soaking stage to the 1st true leaf stage they hear the fresh sound of Static X & Seven Dust. Out in the lonely garden its pretty dam quiet inside a coldframe(thus the lack of growth). Why did'nt I think of this before? This year I will try running some speakers from the house out to the the garden. This should make their new outside surroundings much like it was when they were living inside...Rock on Deano

2/5/2004 1:38:25 PM

[email protected]

Doc's half gallon ice cream container idea is well documented in his 2004 grower's diary. He has pictures and wording to take you through it step by step. I may be going to this method in 2004, as I too have found root bound plants to become lagged when taking them from one medium to another. I also agree with Andy Wolf in to the point that they need to be outside as soon as possible, being cautious as to the weather conditions and such. The switch from artificial to natural sun is like going from Bud Light to Guiness Stoudt beer... Too harsh of a change to do over night..

2/5/2004 2:21:49 PM

[email protected]

Light, temperature, humidity, atmospheric gases, root disturbances,...lot's of variables here folks. All cause stress. Our job is to minimize the stress.

2/5/2004 2:51:01 PM

Utah

Joe- nice pictures in your diary today... I have some similar pictures from last season -there are a few in my diary.
I used plastic 5 quart ice cream buckets. they work well if you don't have very many plants. other wise they start taking up a lot of space.

2/5/2004 2:59:23 PM

Key West, FL

I think they just start off growing slow.

2/5/2004 3:01:05 PM

Western NY

i'm thinking i should try the musical approach. wayne static screaming at me would be motivation, certainly should be for the plants.

Rocky: very apt beer comparison.

2/5/2004 3:01:50 PM

Nova Scotia

were i'm from direct planting is the way to go. but if i was north i would heat the area i was going to plant and still plant direct for i think the benifits outway the negitives if done right.

2/5/2004 4:59:14 PM

In the shade - PDX, OR

I think that there is a perception issue here.

As Steve mentions there are quite a few variables to consider. One more that I would like to pose is "seeing" what is happening under the soil.

Depending on the circumstances, I believe that there is a great deal of root growing activity that we cannot see. Maybe it might SEEM as if nothing is going on, however the roots are doing their thing. Growing and seeking out nutrients and water.

2/5/2004 8:14:35 PM

Montoursville, PA

Ceiss.........you gotta be kidding. It's just dirt. Hee Hee

2/5/2004 8:38:50 PM

Newmarket, NH USA

In the past I always put my seedlings into a cut into 3 pieces 12 inch nursury pot taped together with duct tape. So at transplant time my roots would have room to adjust. This year I did the same thing but got the plants in the ground very early with only 2 true leaves showing. I left them in my dads climate controlled greenhouse for about 10 to 14 days. Daytime temps 70 to 75 night temps 50 to 55 best looking plants I have ever had. I do believe hardening off some really helped me. Matt

2/7/2004 6:30:53 PM