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San Diego

I have a genetics question. Let me use the beachy 543, 2002 for this example. The 543 was grown from a 705 stelts, and crossed with the 801.5 stelts. Great genetics. Whether growing the seed or using it as a polinator in the future, would it still be considered great genetics or to have great potential to grow a large pumpkin? I ask this because this particular 705 only grew a 543 lb pumpkin. Hence the name 543 Beachy. Not as big as many 705 offspring. So does it pass on smaller genes for the future because it grew a 500 lb pumpkin, or is their a better chance of putting forth bigger genes, or is it a guessing game. Just curious. Thanks, Jim

3/9/2003 12:54:33 AM

Caceres, mid west of Spain

Hey Jim,
this is a nice question many growers are asking himself many times this winter I believe. First of all I would ask the grower why this fruit was so "little", because maybe the plant has an accident with the wind that turn around its main vine like happened last year with the van Kooten 498 and 493, or an insidious insect attack, or he did a bad operation on it. Then, after eliminate any of those cultural causes you can think that that particular seed got bad genetics and it could give them to their offspring. However you should remember that some "small" pumpkins have huge daughters, like the 310 Eisenhour, 455.4 Andrews, or 455 Liggett. And ending this post, for me one of the greatest potential seed is the 518 Kurkowski.
I hope this post to continue being asked by other growers.

Don

3/9/2003 2:34:21 AM

i was just reading this message and got to thinking about genetics....we were studying it in my Advanced Placement Biology class, and in my Plants and Landscaping class, and the book said that one couple, because of crossing over of genes etc, has like 4,000,000,000,000,000 different possibilites of genetic makeups when they produce a child.....Now I know pumpkins don't have as complex genes as humans, and I'm so expert, but since every pollen grain is like a different sperm in a human, and every seed ovule is like a different human egg, isn't it possible that every seed in a pumpkin has a different genes, as well as seeds in different lobes having different genes. But maybe only one ovule is present in a lobe and it splits making genetically identical seeds within a lobe of the pumpkin? Either way, I don't think it is genetically accurate to keep seeds from all lobes of a pumpkin together, but it would be impossible to seperate them all, and seed sorting and labeling would become so complicated. Anyway, just a thought....Sometimes I think I think too much...
Brigitte

3/9/2003 10:05:43 PM

[email protected]

Hey Carlos,
What do you know about the 518 Kurkowski? I have that seed.
Did it go small due to environmental factors?
Steve

3/10/2003 5:33:22 AM

Caceres, mid west of Spain

Steve,
Besides its cross, is a hunch. However, I talked with Greg about it, here you have a transcription of his kind letter:
"I have never grown the 518 my self. However I know of two growers that have. George Lloyd from Canada, he wrote me this winter and told me the 518 grew to about 550 pounds and then quite growing. He said that it was a nice orange pumpkin. The other grower was Steve Razo from Ohio and I believe his plant produces a 500 pound pumpkin also. I do not have a e-mail address for either of these people. This isn't much info but I hope it helps some."
Nevetherless, I still having a hunch with it... When I have it in my hand, I feel it has the potential to stablish a new World Record...

Don

3/10/2003 6:17:00 AM

[email protected]

Carlos, Are you going to grow the 518? I like the cross too. Opposite of 2 others I have. The 845 Nesbitt & 707 Toftness.
Steve

3/10/2003 9:31:20 AM

Frankfurt, Germany

Brigitte: Yes, pumpkins don't have as complex genes as humans -- they are more complex. Pumpkins are having 40 pairs of chromosomes, humans 36. But pumpkins are quatroploid, meaning they have a four sets of 10 Chromosomes - and the polen and the ovule have a half set of this fourty , meaning that there are 70 different pairings of each chromosome passing from _each_ parent, making it 4900 different parings of _every_ qatroploid set of a chromosome with every polination - making it 7,97e+36 (a number with 36 digits) different possibilities of a descendant of just every two parents.

(a human child bears "only" 4.72e+21 possibilities)

but who is really cares? *grin*

3/10/2003 2:01:33 PM

lol....pumpkins may have 40, but humans have 23 pair, not 36.

3/10/2003 6:06:26 PM