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Brooklin, Ontario, Canada

This will be my first year growing Atlantic Giants and normally I would apologize in advance for what is sure to to be a summer full of silly questions that have been answered time and again, but from what I've read on this site you are the most supportive group of people around, so I wont feel so bad for asking.

I am working with a very limited amount of space (I have been able to till up an area 10'x12', and I can allow the plant to grow to an area of about 12'x18'). After reading one of my earlier posts, some local growers have sent me some awesome seeds with (from what I've read) some great genetics. I would really like to put both of their seeds in the ground this year, but obviously only have room for one of them to reach maturity.

Here is my question...How long does it take for a male flower to appear, and what size would the plant be at that stage? I am wondering if I can start the two seeds, use the male flower from one to pollinate the other and then terminate the first to allow the second the full patch to grow in.

I remember reading in someone's diary that they planted a seed in a pot through the winter and that it has now flowered in the pot. Would this be an option, or would the potted seed take longer to reach the flower stage of development?

Worst case scenario, I can just self pollinate one of the plants, but now that I've received these great genetics, I want them all in my pumpkin for this year!!

If anyone out there with a small patch like mine has any pointers specific to the space limitations and would like to share some pointers, I'd love to hear them!

David

5/4/2005 7:38:39 PM

[email protected]

Some early males might appear as the vine reaches 6-8 feet in length. You might wish to grow the secondary plant with no secondary vines on one side (flag pattern) or even with no secondaries at all (viper? I think) so that it may produce males all year. Heck, you might even pollinate a reverse cross for a nice Halloween carver. Many nice carvers have been grown on the edge of or even on a lawn. But pests are more difficult to contain in the overgrown turf.

This forum was designed to help beginners get going. So the only dumb question is the one that is never answered because it was never asked.

5/4/2005 8:45:25 PM

Montoursville, PA

To the basic questions I think.:) I would run the main down the long side on one edge of the patch. Flag Pattern.

Cut off all secondaries wanting to run off the patch. Fill the patch with twelve foot secondaries.

I would try to set one on the main about ten or twelve feet and I would set one on any secondary out there nine or more feet.

Since this is a first year I would grow them both. If something mean happens to one you still could get a nice pumpkin out of the second one on the vine.

You could run a second plant for males in a flower bed and pull it up after the duty is performed. They don't grow nice fruit with minimal attention but they will produce the flowers as good as any in the patch if they have reasonable sun to get up the energy to produce flowers.

You could even run that pollinator along the edge of a neighbors corn field.

5/4/2005 9:40:57 PM

Or

Cross pollination wont affect your pumpkin this year. It only affects the seeds.

5/4/2005 9:45:07 PM

Brooklin, Ontario, Canada

Docgipe:

"I would run the main down the long side on one edge of the patch. Flag Pattern."

That was my original idea, but after reading your post I began to wonder about this ... One of the long edges of the patch is against a fence; would you suggest growing the main along the fence and growing the secondaries towards the lawn (which also means extra heat from the fence for the seedling during the first few weeks), or keeping it as far away from the fence as possible and growing the secondaries towards the fence (which means that the main vine/leaves will get about an extra hour of sunlight a day)?

"If something mean happens to one you still could get a nice pumpkin out of the second one on the vine."

How much does having a second pumpkin on a secondary vine affect the size of the one on the main?

Bananaman:

"Cross pollination wont affect your pumpkin this year. It only affects the seeds."

Wow...that really puts a different spin on things, doesn't it? I guess I always assumed that plants worked the same as critters do. And I thought that I knew all there was to know about these things with all the reading I've done in the last 6 months. ;)LOL

Does that mean that if you self-pollinate, the seeds that are produced will be the same (genetically) as the one you start with?

Speaking of seeds, about how many does one of these monsters produce (on average)?

5/4/2005 10:31:56 PM

Montoursville, PA

Seed question: Possibly none up to as many as seven hundred or more.

Run the secondaries to the open yard. That lets you get in to weed and service the plant easier.

You are in minimal space. Growing one is risky. Lots of things can happen. My guess is one 500 and one 300 if you are lucky. Growing one maybe a six hundred if you do very well. There have be larger ones but on minimal space that would be a rare happening.

On selfing or crossing you will get about as many opinions as there are growers out there. :) I am hoping to drive about a hundred miles to bum some males for something I want to do this summer. They travel in a cooler on ice quite well. I am informed four hours is a safe haul for use as pollinators. I cross 'em. Other's self 'em. Good arguements, for either position. I did not answer one of your selfing questions. I do not feel qualified to do so.

5/4/2005 11:05:19 PM

Brooklin, Ontario, Canada

"I am hoping to drive about a hundred miles to bum some males for something I want to do this summer."

Now there's an idea I hadn't considered...looks like there are lots of good growers here in Ontario, now I just have to get to know them...

5/4/2005 11:13:20 PM

Cameron,ontario Team Lunatic

David
You can get some males from me anytime you want. I would go with one main plant in your garden. There are also a couple of good growers in Orono and Enniskillen. They would help you out if you asked.

Phil

5/5/2005 6:41:08 AM

Brooklin, Ontario, Canada

Thanks, Phil. Is there going to be a meeting of the GVGO in the near future? It would sure be nice to meet some people in person.

5/5/2005 8:56:47 AM

Atlanta, Georgia

elkman,
I only have one suggestion...
Make a big mound at the edge of your patch where you start your plant, whatever you do or however you decide to train. This will give you more potential main vine length.

5/5/2005 9:39:33 AM

Brooklin, Ontario, Canada

Mike,

Thanks for the suggestion. What size would you suggest a 'big mound' would be (Length x Width x Depth)

5/5/2005 11:17:54 AM

Ljubljana, Slovenia

elkman, as big as you can mound it... be careful though not to change the landscape.. lol

5/5/2005 11:28:02 AM

Ljubljana, Slovenia

one more thing: you may get some more space growing the plant on the fence, trees, or even on the roof (at your own risk: check my 2003 diary)

Oh yeah, lucky growing! Jernej

5/5/2005 11:30:58 AM

Cameron,ontario Team Lunatic

David
The next get-together will be the summer patch tours sheduled for Aug. Then everyone will be at the weigh offs in Oct. We will have our general meeting in the winter of 2006. There we will give out the GVGO trophy to the club champ, have growers seminars and seed swap. Hope to see you at a couple of these events. Dates & times will be posted on the GVGO website.

Phil

5/5/2005 7:20:54 PM

Brooklin, Ontario, Canada

How far away from the fence would you suggest I place the seedling? I was originally only going to put it 1' away, but the pictures I've seen of some of these plants is making me wonder.

5/5/2005 9:03:56 PM

[email protected]

A friend lets the secondary vines on one side grow down a wall to add more energy producing foliage to his plants. They can't produce secondary roots this way, but they do photosynthate.

Perhaps you could carefully train some secondary vines UP that fence to increase plant size.

5/6/2005 5:07:32 AM

Brooklin, Ontario, Canada

Thanks, Tremor...after reading through Jernej's 2003 diary I wondered about that, but I think that the leaves growing up would shade the main vine leaves too much, unless I grew the main right down the middle of the patch which wouldn't leave too much room for the rooted secondaries. Am I correct in assuming that it would be better for the main vine leaves to get full sun rather than the secondaries?

5/6/2005 9:03:55 AM

Montoursville, PA

Estimated some twenty leaves, on the main and ten on each secodary. Estimate sixteen secondaries each with ten leaves. Where will the major resources be?

5/6/2005 8:58:08 PM