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New Jersey

After reading up on some hydroponic growing systems I noticed that many of them rely one different concepts which
aerate the water. Thereby increasing dissolved oxygen. I'm no botanist, but the plants use the oxygen in their energy creation process. How many of you aerate your water prior to putting in the dirt?

Thanks In advance I'm looking foward to your replies.
I just found this nice site, pretty cool. Thumbs up to
the creators. :)

3/13/2003 8:55:10 PM

Ctpumpkin@optonline.net

Hi Memy,
Welcome. I think you will find there are good & very helpful people here.

We recently had a conversation about using various compounds to help improve soil oxygen levels. Here's a link to that thread:

http://www.bigpumpkins.com/MsgBoard/ViewThread.asp?b=3&p=34334

If that doesn't work, go back to the last page of this board (general discussion) & look for "soil oxygenation" or just do a search. Many of the products discussed have been employed by hydroponic gardeners.

Please share your thoughts on the subject too.

Steve

3/13/2003 10:12:41 PM

New Jersey

Interesting link, however I'm speaking more of oxygenating the water.

Here's some things which may be of interest I found round the net.

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The amount of oxygen that a given volume of water can hold is a function of:

1. The pressure the atmospheric oxygen is exerting at the air- water interface.

2. The temperature of the water.

3. The amount of other substances dissolved in the water.

and I would add- 4. Amount of additional air-to-water contact generated by forced-air bubbles or surface agitation.


oxygenated directly correlates to the speed of growth and
is one of the most overlooked nutrients. One factor you cannot control is altitude, but air pressure is one factor in determining the maximum solubility.

The temperature is something we can control. Anyone who has kept fish knows how quickly O2 solubility trails off once the water becomes heated. Similarly, the colder it gets, the more oxygen is available in solution.. So we must strike a balance of low temperatures for O2 and warmer temperatures for a faster metabolic rate.

------------------

Something to think about as I've seen many people here warm their water.

Can't wait to see my pumpkins grow this year.

3/13/2003 11:57:28 PM

Montoursville, PA

Quick order me up fifty bags of crushed ice to stack around my barrels. Point well made but if one uses drip or underground irregation the movement or flow is so slow that ambient becomes the issue in process. The soil in effect creates ambient therefore neither heating or cooling would seem to have much effect. Maximum oxygen would travel with the water providing it had not been cooked out and could not have re-entered.

I can see it all now. Bubbling barrels!:)

3/14/2003 8:41:57 AM

Montoursville, PA

I guess the issue becomes a determination for overhead application of water. Which may be more important the oxygen content of cooler water or the thermal shock which may be reduced by using warmer water.

I have always thought that all barrell sun warmed water would become ambient and well oxygenated in process as it is delivered by the sprinkler. Would not the difference in coolness from well, pond or tap also go to ambient or near ambient in process?

Therefore would not the cooler water not quite making ambient carry more oxygen and not have any significant difference from natural rain when coming from sprinklers?

Should not the water enter the ground a tad cooler than above ground ambient to account for ambient underground?
Would warmer actually drive oxygen away from the underground environment?

Just asking questions!

3/14/2003 8:58:21 AM

Ctpumpkin@optonline.net

It would be possible to install aquarium type "air stones" in the barrels. And there are probably a raft of other means too....interesting...

Does anyone know if water can be tested at home for disolved oxygen? I know labs can do test for O2, but the levels would change during transportation. Perhaps a trip to the pet store is in order.

Steve

3/14/2003 9:25:24 AM

Caceres, mid west of Spain

Yes it can. I analyzed for one year the water of a river and I tested weekly the oxigen level with a electronic machine.
But, as far as most of us use sprinklers to irrigate, the water reach the soil with a high content of O2; only who irrigate with a big water flow running over the ground has to worry about this subject, and they can use low concentrations of hidrogen peroxide diluted in the water.

Don

3/14/2003 9:57:52 AM

Appalachian Mtns.

I have an idea of adding hydrogen peroxide twice weekly to my drip line system this year. I have a source for relatively high, but not caustic when added to 55 gallons, concentration H2O2.
I'm trying to determine the proper solution...have many e-mails out to those who may know. I also want to know the effect on the drip line itself...and how effective H2O2 can be in preventing line clogs.
At least mind-wheels are turning :0)

3/14/2003 7:01:49 PM

Appalachian Mtns.

Shall we can bring up calcium and magnesium peroxide soil applications to increase soil O2?
Agricultural grade calcium peroxide= $110 per pound.

3/14/2003 7:04:28 PM

Appalachian Mtns.

"Shall we can.."???

3/14/2003 7:04:59 PM

Montoursville, PA

Hey...if you are going to run stuff like that a your system you should look at the Magnetic Devise in my diary. It was and is for situations just like this. Simple and very cost effective if it opens or prevents buildups from any slurry passing by. Don't overlook the simplicity of that thingy.
Lissa at Drip Works will get you thinking. Talk to her or her guys in association.

3/14/2003 10:28:20 PM

Ctpumpkin@optonline.net

WOW! $110/Lb is even more than those silly little 500 gm (equals about 17 oz.) bottles we found for $20.00!!! But that may have been a very dilute mixture.

I can't stand when the percent concentration isn't listed on these retail "garden preperations". And just try to find a label or MSDS on these items!

Kyle, what was the %concentration of the material you were quoted?

I think it's time we look to the textile industry for their source of magnesium peroxide. They use it in strong concentrations to bleach fabrics, presumably in preperation for color dying.
I have a customer who's family used to have a weaving business down in the garment district. I need to call him anyway. Maybe he'll be able to help us.

Steve

3/14/2003 10:34:38 PM

Western NY

i got 10 kilos (thats about 22 pounds) for a little over 100 dollars last year. it was ag grade, and 60% calcium peroxide (the standard concentration). pretty good deal when you compare to what some places get for 500 grams.

Andy

3/14/2003 11:06:26 PM

Ctpumpkin@optonline.net

Andy,
Do you remember where you bought it?
Steve

3/14/2003 11:21:09 PM

Appalachian Mtns.

Yea, where from Andy?

3/15/2003 3:10:28 AM

Western NY

I got it from canada because of a slightly better deal. go to your local hydroponics store, if you have one and see if they can get you a product called Oxy-Cal. it's fairly widespread, shouldn't be much of a problem to get.

one side note, only use this stuff if you have a very low pH. mine jumped about a whole point in a year. i may use it again this year, but probably not again after that. i just don't want my pH to get much higher.

oh, and for those looking into magnesium peroxide, i probably wouldn't reccomendit unless you are really deficient in magnesium.

Andy

3/15/2003 9:00:53 PM

Appalachian Mtns.

OK...there are many places on the Internet from which to order 35% hydrogen peroxide. I've been unable to find a supplier of 70% that will sell to private individuals, FMC, Solvay, etc. Cheapest I've found is $52 per gallon 35%.
I'm reading conflicting reports on how to dilute HP in your pumpkin watering supply...is it 1 cup per 250 gallons? 1 gallon to every 11 gallons of water? Another formulation?
Is the diluted to 3% too harsh for the root system? Not strong enough?
Many questions..no answers for AG growing purposes.

3/16/2003 7:58:38 AM

Appalachian Mtns.

Oxy-Cal thru "normal" suppliers is $20 per 1.1 pounds!

3/16/2003 8:01:16 AM

Ctpumpkin@optonline.net

I knew the rate questions were coming.
I triwed to purchase a disolved oxygen tester yesterday. Out of stock. The key is to balance rate with the result. Typically, 1/3 - 1/5 the rate where damage is expressed (by wilting/lack of growth/cellular descication/etc) in bench studies. We're running low on time, but can still work some seedling testes this way.

Steve

3/16/2003 9:37:15 AM

Appalachian Mtns.

Steve,
Too funny! "Seedling testes"?.....man, they really are giants!

3/16/2003 9:41:44 AM

Ctpumpkin@optonline.net

Typing too fast. Couldn't have been much worse though! LOL

3/16/2003 5:24:20 PM

Appalachian Mtns.

Sooo...any ideas for proper rates of 35% HP in 55-gallon water drums?

3/17/2003 7:40:35 AM

New Jersey

Wow so many excellent replies thank you all for the info and ideas, I have much research to do now! Oh boy! :)

3/31/2003 7:19:35 PM

ballston spa N.Y

here is a good link to mixing HP to water, hope this helps everyone
http://www.using-hydrogen-peroxide.com/gardening-with-hydrogen-peroxide.html

4/25/2012 11:38:16 PM

ballston spa N.Y

does any one know how long cal-max will let off oxygen once its put into the soil?

4/25/2012 11:45:18 PM